Draft minutes of SAS Protocol Teleconference - Oct 15, 2002

John Lohmeyer lohmeyer at t10.org
Tue Oct 15 12:56:52 PDT 2002


* From the T10 Reflector (t10 at t10.org), posted by:
* John Lohmeyer <lohmeyer at t10.org>
*
A PDF of these minutes is available at:

   ftp://ftp.t10.org/t10/document.02/02-408r0.pdf

Accredited Standards Committee*
InterNational Committee for Information Technology Standards (INCITS)

                                                    Doc. No.: T10/02-408r0
                                                        Date: October 15, 2002
                                                    Reply to: John Lohmeyer
To:       T10 Membership
From:     John Lohmeyer
Subject:  SAS Protocol Teleconference -- October 15, 2002

Agenda
1.     Opening Remarks
2.     Approval of Agenda
3.     Attendance and Membership
4.     Old Business
4.1      SAS Working Draft Review [Elliott]
4.2      SAS Relative Offset (02-319) [Gardner]
4.3      SAS Data Corruption Problem (02-323) [Gardner]
4.4      SAS Spinup (02-360) [Elliott]
4.5      SAS Disconnect-Reconnect Mode Parameters (02-324) [Gardner]
4.6      STP Initiators closing connections (02-363) [Day]
4.7      Informative Annex on Expanders (02-291) [Hoglund]
4.8      SAS Programmable PPTOV (02-387) [Hoglund]
4.9      SAS Change Notification Proposal (02-383) [Reif]
4.10     SAS SPC-3 Protocol Specific log page (02-394) [Elliott]
4.11     CRC on Frame Header [Roberts]
5.     New Business
5.1      SAS Device Identification VPD page requirements (02-396) [Elliott]
5.2      Alternate SAS Speed Negotiation State Diagram (02-405) [Penokie]
5.3      SAS Protocol Specific Port mode page (02-397) [Elliott]
5.4      Renumbering DEVICE TYPEs to start at 1 rather than 0 (reflector
message) [Elliott]
5.5      SAS Expander Change Count Proposal (02-409) [Besmer]
5.6      Close on CLOSE [Worden]
5.7      What happens to low priority open requests? [Penokie]
5.8      Remove SAS SMP margin control functions? (reflector message)
[Elliott]
6.     Review of Recommendations to the Plenary
7.     Meeting Schedule
8.     Adjournment


Results of Meeting

1.     Opening Remarks

John Lohmeyer called the meeting to order at 9:00 a.m. MDT, Tuesday, October
15, 2002. He thanked George Penokie for hosting the call and John Worden for
hosting the WebEx session.


2.     Approval of Agenda

The draft agenda was approved with the following changes:

5.5      SAS Expander Change Count Proposal (02-409) [Besmer]
5.6      Close on CLOSE [Worden]
5.7      What happens to low priority open requests? [Penokie]

The following item was added during the course of the meeting:

5.8      Remove SAS SMP margin control functions? (reflector message)
[Elliott]


3.     Attendance and Membership

Attendance at working group meetings does not count toward minimum attendance
requirements for T10 membership. Working group meetings are open to any person
or organization directly and materially affected by T10's scope of work. The
following people attended the meeting:

          Name          S        Organization         Electronic Mail Address
---------------------- -- ------------------------- -------------------------
Mr. John Packer        V  Adaptec, Inc.
Mr. Kyle Sterling      V  Adaptec, Inc.             ksterlin at corp.adaptec.com
Mr. Bill Galloway      P  BREA Technologies, Inc.   billg at breatech.com
Mr. Lafe Moon          V  Data Transit Corp.        lafe at data-transit.com
Mr. David Freeman      V  Data Transit Corp.        davidf at data-transit.com
Mr. Rob Elliott        P  Hewlett Packard Co.       Elliott at hp.com
Mr. Steven Fairchild   V  Hewlett Packard Co.       Steve.Fairchild at hp.com
Mr. Thomas Grieff      V  Hewlett Packard Co.       Thomas.Grieff at hp.com
Mr. Jim Reif           V  Hewlett Packard Co.       jim.reif at hp.com
Mr. Matt Otto          V  I-TECH Corp.              matt_otto at i-tech.com
Mr. Steven Wirtz       V  I-TECH Corp.              steve_wirtz at i-tech.com
Mr. George O. Penokie  P  IBM / Tivoli Systems      gop at us.ibm.com
Mr. Pak Seto           V  Intel                     pak-lung.seto at intel.com
Mr. Robert Sheffield   A  Intel Corp.               robert.l.sheffield at intel.
                                                     com
Mr. John Lohmeyer      P  LSI Logic Corp.           lohmeyer at t10.org
Mr. Tim Hoglund        V  LSI Logic Corp.           tim.hoglund at lsil.com
Mr. Brad Besmer        V  LSI Logic Corp.           brad.besmer at lsil.com
Mr. Steve Johnson      V  LSI Logic Corp.           sjohnson at lsil.com
Mr. Mark Evans         P  Maxtor Corp.              mark_evans at maxtor.com
Mr. Steve Byan         V  Maxtor Corp.              stephen_byan at maxtor.com
Mr. Ting Li Chan       V  QLogic Corp.              ting.chan at qlogic.com
Mr. Arie Krantz        V  QLogic Corp.              l_krantz at qlc.com
Mr. John Worden        V  Seagate Technology        john.worden at seagate.com
Mr. Scott Younger      V  Seagate Technology        Scott.Younger at seagate.com

24 People Present

Status Key:  P    -  Principal
              A,A# -  Alternate
              AV   -  Advisory Member
              L    -  Liaison
              V    -  Visitor


4.     Old Business

4.1    SAS Working Draft Review [Elliott]

This item was deferred due to the late hour.

4.2    SAS Relative Offset (02-319) [Gardner]

In the absence of Ed Gardner, this item was deferred.

4.3    SAS Data Corruption Problem (02-323) [Gardner]

In the absence of Ed Gardner, this item was deferred.

4.4    SAS Spinup (02-360) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented 02-360r1, SAS Spinup. He received input and agreed to
revise his proposal.

4.5    SAS Disconnect-Reconnect Mode Parameters (02-324) [Gardner]

In the absence of Ed Gardner, this item was deferred.

4.6    STP Initiators closing connections (02-363) [Day]

In the absence of Brian Day, this item was deferred.

4.7    Informative Annex on Expanders (02-291) [Hoglund]

Tim Hoglund asked that this item be deferred.

4.8    SAS Programmable PPTOV (02-387) [Hoglund]

Tim Hoglund presented 02-387r1, SAS Programmable PPTOV. He received input and
agreed to revise his proposal. Tim Hoglund moved and Bill Galloway seconded
that 02-387r2 (r1 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS. The motion
passed unanimously.

4.9    SAS Change Notification Proposal (02-383) [Reif]

Jim Reif discussed his 02-383r1 proposal on changes to the CHANGE
notification. He received input and agreed to revise his proposal. Jim Reif
moved and Bill Galloway seconded that 02-383r2 (r1 as revised) be recommended
for inclusion in SAS. The motion passed unanimously.

4.10   SAS SPC-3 Protocol Specific log page (02-394) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented 02-394r0, SAS SPC-3 Protocol Specific log page. Rob
noted that both SAS and CAP will need to approve this proposal since it
affects both SAS and SPC-3. He received input and agreed to revise his
proposal. Rob Elliott moved and Bill Galloway seconded that 02-394r1 (r0 as
revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS. The motion passed unanimously.

4.11   CRC on Frame Header [Roberts]

In the absence of Ron Roberts, this item was deferred.


5.     New Business

5.1    SAS Device Identification VPD page requirements (02-396) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented 02-396r0, SAS Device Identification VPD page
requirements. He received input and agreed to revise his proposal.

George Penokie noted that some people at Seagate might have an issue with
requiring an NAA of 5h or 6h for the logical unit name since they currently
use an NAA of 2h on their Fibre Channel products. Since Jim Coomes was not
present, we deferred this issue.

5.2    Alternate SAS Speed Negotiation State Diagram (02-405) [Penokie]

George Penokie presented 02-405r0, Alternate SAS Speed Negotiation State
Diagram. He received input. There was controversy on whether the other OOB
state diagrams should be revised per George's approach. We did agree that the
Output boxes should be removed. We also agreed that if the state transitions
are retained, the conventions used (~, + &) need to be documented.
Consideration of the proposal was deferred.

5.3    SAS Protocol Specific Port mode page (02-397) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented 02-397r0, SAS Protocol Specific Port mode page. He
received input and agreed to revise his proposal. Some of the people present
|from drive companies were negative about including this proposal in SAS. We
agreed to defer consideration.

5.4    Renumbering DEVICE TYPEs to start at 1 rather than 0 (reflector
message) [Elliott]

John Worden moved and Bill Galloway seconded that DEVICE TYPE numbers be
changed to start at 1 and DEVICE TYPE 0 means no device is attached be
recommended for included in SAS. The motion carried unanimously.

5.5    SAS Expander Change Count Proposal (02-409) [Besmer]

Brad Besmer presented 02-409r0, SAS Expander Change Count Proposal. He
received input (mostly on standardese) and agreed to revise the proposal.

5.6    Close on CLOSE [Worden]

Jim Coomes asked John Worden to make sure that this item be covered as soon as
possible since it affects hardware. The question was which type of primitive
should CLOSE be: single, triple, or redundant? It is currently the only triple
primitive. It has been suggested that CLOSE be changed to single or redundant
to eliminate the triple state machine in hardware. Most people agreed that if
any change is made, we should change CLOSE to redundant. After considering the
options, the group agreed to leave CLOSE as a triple primitive.

5.7    What happens to low priority open requests? [Penokie]

George Penokie discussed and received input on open address frames crossing in
the night. He said he will review the wording in SAS to see if any changes are
necessary.

5.8    Remove SAS SMP margin control functions? (reflector message) [Elliott]

Since Ron Roberts was not present on the call, the topic was deferred.

6.     Review of Recommendations to the Plenary

John Lohmeyer noted that the following recommendations were made during this
meeting:

that 02-387r2 (r1 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS.
that 02-383r2 (r1 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS.
that 02-394r1 (r0 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS.
that DEVICE TYPE numbers be changed to start at 1 and DEVICE TYPE 0 means no
device is attached be recommended for included in SAS.

The following recommendation was made on the October 1st conference call:

that 02-359r3 (r2 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS. [4:3:2]
that 02-393r1 (r0 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS.

The following recommendation was made on the September 24th conference call:

that 02-318r1 be recommended for inclusion in SAS.
that 02-202r4 (r3 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS.
that 02-276r3 (r2 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in SAS.
that we recommend to T10 that the SSP Task IU be changed to 28 bytes to match
the command IU by removing the last 4 reserved bytes.

The following recommendation was made on the September 17th conference call:

that a statement saying STP initiators shall not generate BIST frames be
recommended for inclusion in SAS.


7.     Meeting Schedule

SAS Protocol Working Group meetings are scheduled for:

Thursday-Friday, October 24-25, 2002 in Las Vegas in conjunction with the T13
meeting.

Monday-Tuesday, November 4-5, 2002 commencing at 1:00 p.m. on Monday and
ending at 5:00 p.m. on Tuesday in Huntington Beach, CA at the Hilton
Waterfront Hotel (714-960-7873).

George Penokie agreed to host a SAS Protocol teleconference October 22nd. The
first half of this meeting will be technical and the second half will be an
editorial review. Call details are:

    Tuesday October 22, 2002
    11:00 am -- 2:00 pm  EDT
    10:00 am -- 1:00 pm  CDT
     9:00 am -- noon     MDT
     8:00 am -- 11:00 am PDT

    USA Toll Free Number: 877-921-6914
             Toll Number: +1-712-923-0332
    Participant Passcode: 338024

WebEx Session: http://seagate.webex.com/
  Meeting Name: SAS Protocol teleconference
      Password: Carol22

An editing meeting is planned for November 7-8, 2002 in Huntington Beach, CA.
The meeting will start following the plenary meeting and run through 1:00 pm
on Friday.


8.     Adjournment

The meeting was adjourned at 1:12 p.m. MDT on Tuesday, October 15, 2002.


--
John Lohmeyer                  Email: lohmeyer at t10.org
LSI Logic Corp.                Voice: +1-719-533-7560
4420 ArrowsWest Dr.              Fax: +1-719-533-7183
Colo Spgs, CO 80907

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