Draft minutes of Parallel SCSI WG -- March 12, 2002

John Lohmeyer lohmeyer at t10.org
Tue Mar 12 14:51:42 PST 2002


* From the T10 Reflector (t10 at t10.org), posted by:
* John Lohmeyer <lohmeyer at t10.org>
*
Accredited Standards Committee*
InterNational Committee for Information Technology Standards (INCITS)

                                                      Doc. No.: T10/02-100r0
                                                          Date: March 12, 2002
                                                      Reply to: John Lohmeyer
To:       T10 Membership
From:     Ralph Weber & John Lohmeyer
Subject:  Parallel SCSI Working Group Meeting -- March 12, 2002
           Dallas, TX

Agenda
1.     Opening Remarks
2.     Approval of Agenda
3.     Attendance and Membership
4.     SPI-5 Topics
4.1      Periodic structures on SCSI buses (00-352) [Barnes]
4.2      SPI-5 Programmable Termination (01-270) [Aloisi]
4.3      Timing Budget (02-047) [Petty]
4.4      SPI-5 Testing [Manildi]
4.5      Ultra640 SCSI Receiver Offset Issues (02-038) [Brown]
4.6      Ultra640 SCSI Training Pattern Proposal (02-039) [Leshay]
4.7      Driver/Receiver Asymmetry Correction (02-045) [Petty]
4.8      Proposal for offset correction for Ultra640 SCSI for SPI-5 (02-079)
[Brown]
4.9      SPI-5 Status
4.10     Messages During Packetized [Bellamy]
4.11     Negotiation Issues [Galloway]
4.12     Offset Numbers In Annex F [Sweazey]
4.13     Timing Budget in SPI-4 [Petty]
4.14     Training Patterns [Houlder]
5.     Old Business
5.1      Project Proposal for SPI-6 (01-145) [Lohmeyer]
5.2      PIP Report [Ham]
6.     New Business
6.1      FCP-2, SPI-3/4 SPC-2/3 Protocol Identifier field location conflicts
(reflector messages) [Houlder]
7.     Review of Recommendations to the Plenary
8.     Meeting Schedule
9.     Adjournment

Results of Meeting

1.     Opening Remarks

John Lohmeyer, the T10 Chair, called the meeting to order at 9:00 a.m.,
Tuesday, March 12, 2002. He thanked Paul Aloisi of Texas Instruments for
hosting the meeting.

As is customary, the people attending introduced themselves and a copy of the
attendance list was circulated.


2.     Approval of Agenda

The draft agenda was approved with the following changes:

4.10     Messages During Packetized [Bellamy]
4.11     Negotiation Issues [Galloway]
4.12     Offset Numbers In Annex F [Sweazey]
4.13     Timing Budget in SPI-4 [Petty]
4.14     Training Patterns [Houlder]

No items were added/revised during the course of the meeting.


3.     Attendance and Membership

Attendance at working group meetings does not count toward minimum attendance
requirements for T10 membership. Working group meetings are open to any person
or organization directly and materially affected by T10's scope of work. The
following people attended the meeting:

          Name          S        Organization         Electronic Mail Address
---------------------- -- ------------------------- -------------------------
Mr. Vince Bastiani     V  Adaptec Consultant        bass.tech at gte.net
Mr. Ron Roberts        P  Adaptec, Inc.             Ron_Roberts at adaptec.com
Mr. Bill Galloway      P  BREA Technologies, Inc.   billg at breatech.com
Mr. Brian Forbes       P  Brocade Comm. Systems,    bforbes at brocade.com
                           Inc.
Mr. Robert C. Elliott  P  Compaq Computer Corp.     Robert.Elliott at compaq.com
Dr. William Ham        A  Compaq Computer Corp.     bill_ham at ix.netcom.com
Mr. Wayne Bellamy      V  Compaq Computer Corp.     wayne.bellamy at compaq.com
Mr. Ralph O. Weber     P  ENDL Texas                roweber at acm.org
Mr. Eugene Lew         P  Fujitsu                   elew at fcpa.fujitsu.com
Mr. Nathan Hastad      P  General Dynamics          nathan.hastad at gd-ais.com
Mr. George O. Penokie  P  IBM / Tivoli Systems      gop at us.ibm.com
Mr. John Lohmeyer      P  LSI Logic Corp.           lohmeyer at t10.org
Mr. William Petty      A  LSI Logic Corp.           william.petty at lsil.com
Mr. Travis Bradfield   V  LSI Logic Corp.           travis.bradfield at lsil.com
Mr. Mark Evans         P  Maxtor Corp.              mark_evans at maxtor.com
Mr. Russ Brown         V  Maxtor Corp.              russ_brown at maxtor.com
Mr. Richard Uber       V  Maxtor Corp.              richard_uber at maxtor.com
Mr. Ting Li Chan       V  QLogic Corp.              ting.chan at qlogic.com
Mr. Gerald Houlder     P  Seagate Technology        gerry_houlder at seagate.com
Mr. Paul Sweazey       AV Seagate Technology        sweazeyp at cdg.stsv.
                                                     seagate.com
Mr. Vit Novak          P  Sun Microsystems, Inc.    vit.novak at sun.com
Mr. Paul D. Aloisi     P  Texas Instruments         Paul_Aloisi at ti.com
Mr. Donald R. Getty    A  Texas Instruments         donald_getty at ti.com

23 People Present

Status Key:  P    -  Principal
              A,A# -  Alternate
              AV   -  Advisory Member
              L    -  Liaison
              V    -  Visitor


4.     SPI-5 Topics

4.1    Periodic structures on SCSI buses (00-352) [Barnes]

Based on the recommendations of Bill Ham and Paul Aloisi, the group agreed
remove this item from this and future agendas.

4.2    SPI-5 Programmable Termination (01-270) [Aloisi]

Paul Aloisi presented the revised termination requirements relaxation proposal
(01-270r2) noting that the changes are exactly what the last working group
requested. Paul Aloisi moved that 01-270r2 be recommended for inclusion in
SPI-5. Mark Evans seconded the motion. In the absence of any objections, the
motion passed unanimously.

4.3    Timing Budget (02-047) [Petty]

Bill Petty presented the latest revision of the SPI-5 timing budget
(02-047r1). As a result of reconciling the SPI-5 budget with the approved
SPI-4 budget, the total had become negative.

The group discussed what to do in order to get the total positive again.

Bill noted that all the compensation techniques discussed so far plus some are
going to be required to get a positive budget.

In order to get a timing budget in SPI-5 r0, the group agreed to reduce the
"System Noise Transmit and Receive" and "Cross Talk Induced Jitter" values,
without substantial justification for the change.

Bill Petty moved that 02-113r0 be recommended for inclusion in SPI-5. Paul
Aloisi second the motion. In the absence of any objections, the motion passed
unanimously.

4.4    SPI-5 Testing [Manildi]

In the absence of Bruce Manildi, discussion of this topic was deferred to the
next meeting.

4.5    Ultra640 SCSI Receiver Offset Issues (02-038) [Brown]

Mark Evans asked that this item be removed from this and future agendas.

4.6    Ultra640 SCSI Training Pattern Proposal (02-039) [Leshay]

Mark Evans noted that the issues raised in January have been resolved without
any changes in the proposal and then presented 02-039r0. In response to a
question from Bill Ham, Mark Evans stated that the goal of the proposal is to
keep the time values in the training pattern constant for SPI-5, meaning that
the number of transitions will double in nearly all the cases.

Gerry Houlder stated that, because the number of pulse cycles differs between
Fast-160 and Fast-320, the examples should be changed to be tables. George
requested a detailed proposal with all the wording changes prior to
incorporation of that idea.

Mark Evans moved that 02-039r0 be recommended for inclusion in SPI-5. Bill
Galloway seconded the motion. In the absence of any objections, the motion
passed unanimously.

4.7    Driver/Receiver Asymmetry Correction (02-045) [Petty]

Bill Petty asked that item be removed from this and future agendas.

4.8    Proposal for offset correction for Ultra640 SCSI for SPI-5 (02-079)
[Brown]

Mark Evans presented a proposal to add the concept of differential offset in
Annex A (02-079r0). He noted that the proposal draws on the ideas presented in
02-038r0 to the January group.

Bill Ham questioned the specifics of the proposal regarding exact requirements
on the receiver. Mark and Bill agreed on a revision to the proposal.

Mark Evans moved that 02-079r1 (r0 as revised) be recommended for inclusion in
SPI-5. Bill Galloway seconded the motion. In the absence of any objections,
the motion passed unanimously.

4.9    SPI-5 Status

George Penokie reported that he plans on incorporating all the approved
proposals in SPI-5 r0, to be made available prior to the next meeting.

4.10   Messages During Packetized [Bellamy]

Wayne Bellamy asked that the group consider making the MESSAGE IN phase
DISCONNECT message not supported in packetized for SPI-5.

Since this was seen as a problem also in SPI-4, Bill Ham asked how a change
such as this in SPI-4. John Lohmeyer described both the public review process
on SPI-4 and options the committee for revising the dpANS after public review.

Wayne described a similar request for the RESTORE POINTERS and MODIFY DATA
POINTERS messages, also in packetized. Bill Galloway supported Wayne on this
point.

Bill Galloway volunteered to write a detailed proposal for SPI-5 based on the
consensus of the group. Bill noted that his preference would be to make MODIFY
DATA POINTERS obsolete in SPI-5 and George Penokie asked that he announce that
specifically on the T10 reflector.

The group agreed that this is a SPI-5 issue, only and does not need to be
changed in SPI-4. If SPI-4 were to be changed for some other reason, George
suggested that we also make these changes in SPI-4.

4.11   Negotiation Issues [Galloway]

Bill Galloway raised concerns about Figure 19 in 4.12.7.5 in SPI-4. The Figure
shows that switching to another bus phase after a WDTR indicates success in
the negotiation. Bill argued that, since going to another bus phase is a
violation of the SDTR/WDTR protocol, it should not be considered success.

Rob Elliott felt that the table should indicate that a WDTR not followed by an
SDTR is at least partially successful. Bill was willing to allow the initiator
to "muddle on" with as much information as it has, but he was unyielding on
the question of calling the negotiation successful.

Gerry Houlder noted that the requirement that WDTR be followed by an SDTR is
relatively new.

Bill Galloway agreed to write a specific change proposal for SPI-5.

4.12   Offset Numbers In Annex F [Sweazey]

Paul Sweazey questioned the REQ/ACK offset values in table F.4. George agreed
that the numbers are wrong, noting that the values do not agree with the rules
for paced transfers.

Paul noted that the annex is informative and so the changes are not critical
in SPI-4.

George Penokie took notes on the specific needed editorial changes for SPI-5
and agreed to make them in SPI-5.

4.13   Timing Budget in SPI-4 [Petty]

Bill Petty questioned the content of SPI-4   table 49, specifically the
"system noise at launch" and "system noise at receiver". Bill Petty wondered
if the two values were really the same thing. Ting Chan and Bill Ham stated
that they are different things and Bill Ham explained the causes of the
differences to Bill Petty's satisfaction.

4.14   Training Patterns [Houlder]

Gerry Houlder raised questioned a statement that a signal be asserted and
negated 8 times in the SPI-4 training pattern, whereas the time allowed to do
the assertions and negations only is long enough for 4 cycles (see SPI-4
10.7.4.3.3).

The group agreed that the example equation computing the time contains a wrong
value (6.25 should be 12.5) and that the change is editorial. George agreed to
make the editorial change in SPI-5. Gerry asked that, if any changes are made
in SPI-4, this change be made too and George agreed.


5.     Old Business

5.1    Project Proposal for SPI-6 (01-145) [Lohmeyer]

John Lohmeyer asked that this item be deferred to the May meeting.

5.2    PIP Report [Ham]

Bill Ham reported that the PIP working group is meeting twice per month in
order to be ready for letter ballot in May.


6.     New Business

6.1    FCP-2, SPI-3/4 SPC-2/3 Protocol Identifier field location conflicts
(reflector messages) [Houlder]

Gerry Houlder asked that the protocol identifier field be moved from byte 2 to
byte 3. The group refused to make the change on the grounds that all other
protocols have the field in byte 2.

Gerry raised a similar question about the sub page format and here the agreed
solution was to change SPC-3. Gerry agreed to prepare a proposal for changing
SPC-3.


7.     Review of Recommendations to the Plenary

Ralph Weber noted that the following recommendations have been made to the T10
plenary:

SPI-5 Programmable Termination (01-270r2) [Aloisi]
Ultra640 SCSI Training Pattern Proposal (02-039r0) [Evans]
Proposal for offset correction for Ultra640 SCSI for SPI-5 (02-079)r1 [Evans]
{r0 as revised}
SPI-5 timing budget (02-113r0) [Petty]


8.     Meeting Schedule

The next meeting of the Parallel SCSI Working Group will be Monday April 29,
2002 commencing at 9:00 a.m. in Nashua, NH at the Sheraton Nashua Hotel
(603-888-9970).


9.     Adjournment

The meeting was adjourned at 12:30 p.m. on Tuesday, March 12, 2002.

--
John Lohmeyer                  Email: lohmeyer at t10.org
LSI Logic Corp.                Voice: +1-719-533-7560
4420 ArrowsWest Dr.              Fax: +1-719-533-7183
Colo Spgs, CO 80907

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