Draft minutes of SCSI Parallel WG - October 31, 2000

John Lohmeyer lohmeyer at t10.org
Tue Nov 7 09:28:06 PST 2000


* From the T10 Reflector (t10 at t10.org), posted by:
* John Lohmeyer <lohmeyer at t10.org>
*
A PDF version of these minutes is available at:

   ftp://ftp.t10.org/t10/document.00/00-373r0.pdf

Accredited Standards Committee*
National Committee for Information Technology Standards (NCITS)

                                                    Doc. No.: T10/00-373r0
                                                        Date: November 7, 2000
                                                    Reply to: John Lohmeyer
To:       T10 Membership
From:     Ralph Weber & John Lohmeyer
Subject:  Parallel SCSI Working Group Meeting -- October 31, 2000
           Seaside, CA

Agenda
1.     Opening Remarks
2.     Approval of Agenda
3.     Attendance and Membership
4.     SPI-4 Topics
4.1      SPI-4 Physical Topics
4.1.1      Calculated Signal Losses (00-382, 00-246) [Aloisi]
4.1.2      Proposal to replace the TBDs for Fast 160 in SPI-4 and to winnow
options (00-389) [Milligan]
4.1.3      Actual precomp and nonprecomp data (00-406) [Masiewicz]
4.1.4      Receiver Response Requirements (00-332) [Ham]
4.1.5      Proposal for Ultra320 AAF receiver input signal specification for
SPI-4 (00-400 & 00-408) [Brown]
4.1.6      Periodic structures on SCSI buses (00-352) [Barnes]
4.1.7      Vn for OR-Tied Signals (00-320) [Moore]
4.1.8      Ultra320 First Pulse Noise Margin (00-346) [Uber]
4.1.9      SPI-4 Spec Proposal for Ultra320 (00-347) [Uber]
4.1.10     Proposal for Ultra320 SCSI timing skew specification for SPI-4
(00-399) [Brown]
4.1.11     First Pulse and Attenuation Data (00-348) [Manildi]
4.1.12     Attenuation in Actual Subsystems (00-349) [Manildi]
4.1.13     Worst Case Signal Amplitude Calculations Spreadsheet (00-350)
[Manildi]
4.1.14     Comparison of Precomp and AAF (00-351) [Manildi]
4.1.15     Attention setup correction (00-401) [Galloway]
4.1.16     Update on Quantum's AAF for Ultra320 SCSI (00-409) [Evans]
4.2      SPI-4 Protocol Topics
4.2.1      QAS without IU in SPI-4 (00-252) [Elliott]
4.2.2      QAS signal correction (00-402) [Galloway]
4.2.3      Bi-directional data transfers in SPI-4 (00-314) [Elliott]
4.2.4      PPR/MESSAGE REJECT implied agreement (00-337) [Elliott]
4.2.5      Proposed changes to SPI IU exception handling (00-384) [Srinivasan]
4.2.6      Task Status after PPR (00-403) [Galloway]
4.2.7      Reporting Training Values (00-392) [Elliott]
4.2.8      Mode Page Equivalent of ECP (00-396) [Elliott]
4.2.9      Reporting Currently Negotiated Settings (00-397) [Elliott]
4.3      SPI-4 working draft review [Penokie]
4.3.1      Proposed content for SPI-4 rev 1 (00-378) [Penokie]
5.     Expanders and Domain Validation Topics
5.1      Report on the SCSI Domain Validation Meeting (00-376) [Lohmeyer]
6.     New Business
7.     Meeting Schedule
8.     Adjournment
Results of Meeting

1.     Opening Remarks

John Lohmeyer, the T10 Chair, called the meeting to order at 9:00 a.m.,
Tuesday, October 31, 2000.  He thanked Larry Lamers of Adaptec for hosting the
meeting.

As is customary, the people attending introduced themselves and a copy of the
attendance list was circulated.


2.     Approval of Agenda

The draft agenda was approved with the following changes.

4.1.5      Proposal for Ultra320 AAF receiver input signal specification for
SPI-4 (00-400 & 00-408) [Brown]
4.1.12     Attenuation in Actual Subsystems (00-349) [Manildi]
4.1.13     Worst Case Signal Amplitude Calculations Spreadsheet (00-350)
[Manildi]
4.1.14     Comparison of Precomp and AAF (00-351) [Manildi]
4.1.15     Attention setup correction (00-401) [Galloway]
4.1.16     Update on Quantum's AAF for Ultra320 SCSI (00-409) [Evans]
4.2.4      PPR/MESSAGE REJECT implied agreement (00-337) [Elliott]
4.2.5      Proposed changes to SPI IU exception handling (00-384) [Srinivasan]
4.2.6      Task Status after PPR (00-403) [Galloway]
4.2.7      Reporting Training Values (00-392) [Elliott]
4.2.8      Mode Page Equivalent of ECP (00-396) [Elliott]
4.2.9      Reporting Currently Negotiated Settings (00-397) [Elliott]

No items were added/revised during the course of the meeting.


3.     Attendance and Membership

Attendance at working group meetings does not count toward minimum attendance
requirements for T10 membership.  Working group meetings are open to any
person or organization directly and materially affected by T10's scope of
work.  The following people attended the meeting:

          Name          S        Organization         Electronic Mail Address
---------------------- -- ------------------------- -------------------------
Mr. Lawrence J. Lamers P  Adaptec, Inc.             ljlamers at ieee.org
Mr. Ron Roberts        A  Adaptec, Inc.             Ron_Roberts at adaptec.com
Mr. Wally Bridgewater  V  Adaptec, Inc.             wally at eng.adaptec.com
Mr. Lee Hearn          V  Adaptec, Inc.             lee_hearn at corp.adaptec.
                                                     com
Mr. Richard Mcmillan   V  Adaptec, Inc.             richard_mcmillan at adaptec.
                                                     com
Mr. Bill Mable         P  Amphenol Interconnect     mableaipc at aol.com
Mr. Vince Bastiani     V  Bass Technology           bass.tech at gte.net
                           Consulting
Mr. Robert Snively     P  Brocade Comm. Systems,    rsnively at brocade.com
                           Inc.
Mr. Edward Haske       P  CMD Technology            haske at cmd.com
Mr. Robert C. Elliott  P  Compaq Computer Corp.     Rob_Elliott at compuserve.
                                                     com
Dr. William Ham        A  Compaq Computer Corp.     bill_ham at ix.netcom.com
Mr. Titkwan Hui        A. Dallas Semiconductor      tk.hui at dalsemi.com
Mr. Ronald Stockford   P  Dell Computer Corp.       ron_stockford at dell.com
Mr. Kevin Marks        A  Dell Computer Corp.       kevin_marks at dell.com
Mr. Ralph O. Weber     P  ENDL Texas                roweber at acm.org
Mr. Douglas Wagner     P  FCI                       dwagner at fciconnect.com
Mr. Eugene Lew         P  Fujitsu                   elew at fcpa.fujitsu.com
Mr. Nathan Hastad      P  General Dynamics          nathan.j.hastad at gd-is.com
Mr. Sam Ray            V  IBM                       str at us.ibm.com
Mr. George O. Penokie  P  IBM / Tivoli Systems      gpenokie at tivoli.com
Mr. Bill Troop         V  IBM Corp.                 troop at us.ibm.com
Mr. John Lohmeyer      P  LSI Logic Corp.           lohmeyer at t10.org
Mr. William Petty      A  LSI Logic Corp.           william.petty at lsil.com
Mr. Larry Barnes       V  LSI Logic Corp.           larry.barnes at lsil.com
Mr. Travis Bradfield   V  LSI Logic Corp.           travis.bradfield at lsil.com
Mr. Chuck Grant        A# Madison Cable Corp.       cgrant at madisoncable.com
Mr. Jay Neer           P  Molex Inc.                jneer at molex.com
Mr. Richard Moore      A# QLogic Corp.              r_moore at qlc.com
Mr. Ting Li Chan       V  QLogic Corp.              t_chan at qlc.com
Mr. Richard L.         V  QLogic Corp.              r_romaniec at qlc.com
Romaniec
Mr. Tim Hsia           V  QLogic Corp.              t_hsia at qlc.com
Mr. Henry Kuo          V  QLogic Corp.              h_kuo at qlc.com
Mr. Mark Evans         P  Quantum Corp.             mark.evans at quantum.com
Mr. Russ Brown         V  Quantum Corp.             russ.brown at quantum.com
Mr. Richard Uber       V  Quantum Corp.             duber at tdh.qntm.com
Mr. Gene Milligan      P  Seagate Technology        Gene.Milligan at seagate.com
Mr. Gerald Houlder     A  Seagate Technology        gerry_houlder at notes.
                                                     seagate.com
Mr. Daniel (Dan) F.    O  Seagate Technology        daniel_f_smith at notes.
Smith                                               seagate.com
Mr. Umesh Chandra      V  Seagate Technology        umesh_chandra at notes.
                                                     seagate.com
Mr. John Masiewicz     V  Seagate Technology        john_masiewicz at notes.
                                                     seagate.com
Mr. Mayank R. Patel    V  Seagate Technology        mayank_r_patel at notes.
                                                     seagate.com
Mr. Bill Gintz         V  Seus, Inc.                wcgintz at ix.netcom.com
Mr. Erich Oetting      P  Storage Technology Corp.  erich_oetting at stortek.com
Mr. Kenneth Moe        P  Sun Microsystems, Inc.    kenneth.moe at sun.com
Mr. Paul D. Aloisi     P  Texas Instruments         Paul_Aloisi at ti.com
Mr. Donald R. Getty    A# Texas Instruments         donald_getty at ti.com
Mr. Mike Kosco         V  Texas Instruments         mike at chipcraft.com
Mr. Ciro Milazzo       V  Texas Instruments Inc.    ciro_milazzo at ti.com

48 People Present

Status Key:  P    -  Principal
              A,A# -  Alternate
              O    -  Observer
              L    -  Liaison
              V    -  Visitor


4.     SPI-4 Topics

4.1    SPI-4 Physical Topics

4.1.1  Calculated Signal Losses (00-382, 00-246) [Aloisi]

Paul Aloisi reviewed the signal loss spreadsheet (00-382r1) and followed that
presentation with assumptions and requirements proposed for SPI-4 (00-246r5).

It was noted that the specification for the weak driver levels had not been
revised because it was one of the things rejected at the September plenary.
Gene Milligan agreed to bring a specific proposal to correct that to the next
meeting.

Paul stated that the specific proposed changes cannot be considered until the
weak driver level is established.  He stated that revised versions of the
spreadsheet and proposal will be brought to the next meeting.

4.1.2  Proposal to replace the TBDs for Fast 160 in SPI-4 and to winnow
options (00-389) [Milligan]

Gene Milligan presented a proposal for what he thought were agreeable changes
to eliminate several undefined areas in SPI-4.  Issues were raised about what
really was being changed and comparisons between the proposal and SPI-4
revision 0 were discussed.  Several other problems surfaced and Gene agreed to
revise the proposal to address issues raised by the group.

Gene Milligan moved that 00-389r1 (r0 as modified) be approved for inclusion
in SPI-4.  Ron Roberts seconded the motion.  Gene asked that consideration of
the motion be deferred until the other presentations on this topic have been
completed or 1:37 pm which ever occurs first.  In the absence of any
objections consideration was deferred.

When the motion later came up for consideration, George Penokie proposed a
friendly amendment that the masks be labeled "precompensation enabled".  Gene
agreed to the amendment.

Concerns were raised about the weak driver levels in the proposal, Gene
displayed the proposal text and George noted that the numbers in Gene's
proposal were those that got rejected in September.

The motion passed on a vote of 11:2:3.

4.1.3  Actual precomp and nonprecomp data (00-406) [Masiewicz]

John Masiewicz presented laboratory data from actual SPI-4 silicon relevant to
the proposal presented in 4.1.2.  Mark Evans was concerned that all the
without-precomp data appeared to pass the eye diagram requirements.

4.1.4  Receiver Response Requirements (00-332) [Ham]

Bill Ham presented a proposal for testing AAF (Adjustable Active Filter)
systems without specifying the internal behavior of the receiver (00-322r1).
Questions were raised about the usefulness of the proposal.  The 2 ns pulse
width in the proposal was characterized as excessively large and Bill agreed
to reduce it.  Bill stated that a new revision will be presented to the next
meeting.

4.1.5  Proposal for Ultra320 AAF receiver input signal specification for SPI-4
(00-400 & 00-408) [Brown]

Russ Brown presented a proposal for the AAF (Adjustable Active Filter)
signaling method in SPI-4.  Several issues were raised and Russ agreed to
bring a revised proposal to the next meeting.

4.1.6  Periodic structures on SCSI buses (00-352) [Barnes]

Larry Barnes used the Mathlab program to walk the group through bus modeling
issues.

4.1.7  Vn for OR-Tied Signals (00-320) [Moore]

On the assumption that Gene's proposal survives the plenary, Richard Moore
requested this item be removed from future agendas.

4.1.8  Ultra320 First Pulse Noise Margin (00-346) [Uber]

Mark Evans requested that this item be dropped from future agendas.

4.1.9  SPI-4 Spec Proposal for Ultra320 (00-347) [Uber]

Mark Evans requested that this item be dropped from future agendas.

4.1.10 Proposal for Ultra320 SCSI timing skew specification for SPI-4 (00-399)
[Brown]

Russ Brown presented a proposal for a new way of specifying skew requirements.
Several issues were raised and Russ agreed to bring a revised proposal to the
next meeting.

4.1.11 First Pulse and Attenuation Data (00-348) [Manildi]

John Masiewicz asked that this item be dropped from future agendas.

4.1.12 Attenuation in Actual Subsystems (00-349) [Manildi]

John Masiewicz asked that this item be dropped from future agendas.

4.1.13 Worst Case Signal Amplitude Calculations Spreadsheet (00-350) [Manildi]

John Masiewicz asked that this item be dropped from future agendas.

4.1.14 Comparison of Precomp and AAF (00-351) [Manildi]

John Masiewicz asked that this item be dropped from future agendas.

4.1.15 Attention setup correction (00-401) [Galloway]

Bill Petty presented Bill Galloway's proposal to make ATN setup handling like
other signals (00-401r0).  In the absence of any objections, the group
unanimously recommended that 00-401r0 be included in SPI-4.

4.1.16 Update on Quantum's AAF for Ultra320 SCSI (00-409) [Evans]

Mark Evans reviewed the history of AAF (Adjustable Active Filter) noting that
past Quantum presentations have shown that precompensation will not work
correctly in all configurations of Ultra320.  He reviewed the current status
of AAF efforts at Quantum.


4.2    SPI-4 Protocol Topics

4.2.1  QAS without IU in SPI-4 (00-252) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented a revised proposal to allow non-packetized devices to
participate in QAS arbitration (00-252r2).  Minor problems were identified in
the proposal and Rob agreed to make changes.  It was also noted that the SPI-4
editor needs to be given license to make corrections in related tables while
incorporating the proposal.  In the absence of any objections, the group
unanimously recommended that 00-252r3 (r2 as modified) be approved for
inclusion in SPI-4.

4.2.2  QAS signal correction (00-402) [Galloway]

George Penokie presented a proposal from Bill Galloway to correct conflicting
requirements over QAS handling (00-402r0).  In the absence of any objections,
the group unanimously recommended that 00-402r0 be approved for inclusion in
SPI-4.

4.2.3  Bi-directional data transfers in SPI-4 (00-314) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented a proposal to enhance SPI-4 so that bi-directional data
transfers are permitted (00-314r2).  He noted that, after considering the
September working group's recommendation to restrict bi-directional transfers
to Information Unit transfers, he decided to continue to describe all types of
data transfers in the bi-directional proposal.  In the absence of any
objections, the group unanimously recommended that 00-314r2 be approved for
inclusion in SPI-4.

4.2.4  PPR/MESSAGE REJECT implied agreement (00-337) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented a proposal to describe the initiator's response to
getting a PPR message rejected (00-337r1).  In the absence of any objections,
the group unanimously recommended that 00-337r1 be approved for inclusion in
SPI4.

4.2.5  Proposed changes to SPI IU exception handling (00-384) [Srinivasan]

John Lohmeyer asked that discussion of this topic be deferred to the next
meeting.

4.2.6  Task Status after PPR (00-403) [Galloway]

George Penokie presented Bill Galloway's proposal that all tasks be aborted
when a PPR message switches between packetized and non-packetized (00-403r0).
Larry Lamers noted that according to this proposal every domain validation
will abort all outstanding tasks.  Concerns were also raised about how the
task aborting actions were cross-referenced in SPI-4 and how the change
relates to the TASK ABORTED status.  George agreed to inform Bill Galloway of
the issues so that Bill can decide what to bring to the next meeting.

4.2.7  Reporting Training Values (00-392) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented a proposal to use another port control mode subpage (see
item 4.2.8) to report training information from the target to the initiator
(00-392r1).  In the absence of any objections the group unanimously
recommended 00-392r1 for inclusion in SPI-4.

4.2.8  Mode Page Equivalent of ECP (00-396) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented a proposal to communicate ECP (Expander Communication
Protocol) information to targets using an overloading of the port control mode
page (00-396r0).  The proposed usage of subpage codes surfaced several
problems and Rob agreed to work on a new proposal with Ralph Weber, Gerry
Houlder, and others for presentation at the CAP meeting on Wednesday.

George Penokie asked if there was any objections to the concepts described in
the proposal and no objections were heard.

4.2.9  Reporting Currently Negotiated Settings (00-397) [Elliott]

Rob Elliott presented a proposal describing a mechanism for the target to
report it's PPR (Parallel Protocol Request) negotiated settings (00-397r1).
Rob Elliott moved that 00-397r1 be approved for inclusion in SPI-4.  Gerry
Houlder seconded the motion.  The motion passed on a vote of 8:2:2.

4.3    SPI-4 working draft review [Penokie]

4.3.1  Proposed content for SPI-4 rev 1 (00-378) [Penokie]

George Penokie reviewed the content of 00-378r0.

Mark Evans moved that 00-378r0 be recommended for acceptance as SPI-4 revision
1.  George Penokie seconded the motion.  The motion passed on a vote of 5:3:1.


5.     Expanders and Domain Validation Topics

5.1    Report on the SCSI Domain Validation Meeting (00-376) [Lohmeyer]

John Lohmeyer requested that this item be dropped from future agendas and the
group agreed.


6.     New Business

No new business was brought before the meeting.


7.     Meeting Schedule

The next meeting of the Parallel SCSI Working Group will be Tuesday January
16, 2001 commencing at 9:00 a.m. in Lake Buena Vista, FL.


8.     Adjournment

The meeting was adjourned at 7:45 p.m. on Tuesday, October 31, 2000.


--
John Lohmeyer                  Email: lohmeyer at t10.org
LSI Logic Corp.                Voice: +1-719-533-7560
4420 ArrowsWest Dr.              Fax: +1-719-533-7183
Colo Spgs, CO 80907

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